Deb34285 Posted March 6, 2015 Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 Hi All, I have been merrily going along doing much better with adjusting to the larger size needles and tinkering with tension as a George newbie. I have discovered that the Fil-Tec magna glide bobbins work great . I found the bobbins that I wind myself may be a problem. They always look neat and tightly wound.(not wound uneven or sloppily). I will tweak my tension with whatever thread I am using - get it looking good- and the next thing you know it looks awful again. Maybe I stopped for the night and got up in the morning, removing the bobbin , cleaning and oiling before the start of the day, return the bobbin and wam! the tension looks horrible !! Today I went to the sewing Expo and talked with the APQS rep and she asked what I was winding my bobbins on. I told her that I was winding on the Simplicity bobbin winder that came with the purchase of my machine (I had a cheap side-winder from Joann's that's about the same quality)....She kind of winced and asked if I had a DMS that would wind the same size bobbin. It was obvious that she felt that this bobbin winder causes "inconsistent tension" (quote). I drove home thinking about this and think there is a great chance she is right. I don't know why APQS would sell a machine with a bobbin winder that could make consumers struggle with the performance of their machine. It would be better to charge $100 dollars more, but eliminate problems. Having said that- what do you all think is the best bobbin winder out there??? I feel I should be able to wind my own bobbins from time to time without going through this variable tension issues. (I noticed that the George at the show was using a Fil-Tec magnaglide too) thanks, Debbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaniceC Posted March 6, 2015 Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 I am so glad you asked this question! I have been having the same problems, and wondering the same thing. I looked into buying the APQS high-end bobbin winder but it is $350.00 US dollars, so a bit rich for me. There is also the matter of shipping, as I am in Canada. I will follow this thread for others responses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunningThreads Posted March 6, 2015 Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 Janice You could check out Ray at Quilt Tech. https://quilttech.com/product-category/bobbin-winders/ I have dealt with him several times for different things and he always ships fast. I recently ordered some small IQ parts online and within a couple of hours he had refunded some of the shipping because I was overcharged, I hadn't even questioned the charge. These winders are like the one I got with my U1 and work well. Nigel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb34285 Posted March 6, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 Hi Nigel, Do you own this brand of bobbin winder? I agree with Janice that $350 is expensive! I see that he has a sale going on for a winder for $110. Has anyone else used this bobbin winder and love it? Thanks for your input, Debbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimerickson Posted March 6, 2015 Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 Debbie: I agree with Nigel. Ray is a great source for supplies which includes bobbin winders. What you need is an industrial bobbin winder. Even your DSM won't wind bobbins successfully all the time. I'd suggest you buy the "router" control system option that Ray offers, as well. That way you can set the speed you want the winder to wind at, turn it on and do something else while the bobbin winds. No need to hold the speed control while the bobbin winds. I have such a control, and am happy I decided to add it to my winder. The older APQS machines apparently came with such a winder, since I got one with my used Ult2 when I bought it, and Nigel must have had the same experience. I guess when APQS came out with their Turbo winder they felt like if you wanted your bobbins well wound, you could buy that. If you didn't care, the cheap one they sent would do. Do yourself a favor and buy an industrial. I just gave my wife an industrial one to wind her Featherweight bobbins on. Works better than Singer's original, and it's WAY faster. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaniceC Posted March 6, 2015 Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 Hi Jim and Nigel, and Debbie, I just went online thinking to order the winder you suggested. The cost is US$111.00, but added to that is almost $60.00 for shipping. I just couldn't bring myself to do it! I know I will one day when I get too frustrated, but it seems like an awful lot of money. Too bad there isn't a source in Canada. Janice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunningThreads Posted March 6, 2015 Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 Janice Send an email to Ray and ask him what the shipping would be. I suspect the shipping quote may be wrong. I am sure my U1 winder is the one Ray has without speed control. Also PM sent. Nigel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb34285 Posted March 6, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2015 Hi Janice , I emailed Ray earlier today about what the actual cost of shipping would be, but I live in Florida. I also asked about the router control, but was wondering about if the foot pedal would do the same thing but for less $$. I asked him to give me any advise. I will forward on his rely to you. Deb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimerickson Posted March 7, 2015 Report Share Posted March 7, 2015 Debbie: The foot control will do the same thing as the router control, but it requires that you "attend" it all the time it's winding, and you will not necessarily wind the bobbin at a constant speed. The constant speed (or lack of it) is why the on board winders of most of the longarms don't always produce satisfactory results. You won't have as much problem with the foot control speed as the on board winders do, but it's still there. I installed router speed controls on both of my winders because I didn't like standing there working the speed control, and waiting for the bobbin to wind. I use the that time for something else like cleaning lint from the hook. BTW, I never wind more than one bobbin at a time. When the thread runs out, I wind it again. That helps keep me from having a lot of bobbins with thread on them that I didn't need. Jim P.S. I call Ray whenever I place an order. He doesn't seem to mind talking on the phone, and I find his opinion/advise to be very helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb34285 Posted March 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2015 Thanks Jim, I appreciate your advise. I got an email from a gal that bought the gammill bobbing winder, http://store.gammill.net/store/pc/viewCategories.asp?idCategory=17, and it is selling for $90. Is it essentially the same as the quilt tech? This gal said she has equally been very happy with it since going to a new winder- Quilt tech has been the only brand that both you a Nigel recommend so I am reluctant to go in another direction unless its the same at a better $ (will have to check shipping ) thanks, Debbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb34285 Posted March 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2015 Hi Janice, Just going to post the email reply from Ray at Quilt Tech. May not help you since it's US ant not Canada shipping. your shipping will be $17.00 usps 3 day priority mail the router control will let you set the speed so it will be the same speed all the time or you can just put a switch on the cord and it will run at full speed all the time that will not make any difference on the winding as long as you do it same all the time with the control you can run the winder slower it is a personal way you want to wind the bobbins we have a speed control on ours because she likes to wind slow. thank you Ray For US he is very reasonable with shipping costs- worth shooting him an email about cost to Canada Deb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaniceC Posted March 7, 2015 Report Share Posted March 7, 2015 Hi Debbie, I also sent an email to Ray. He says it will probably be about $50.00 for shipping. Seems like an awful lot of money but I went ahead and ordered anyway! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaniceC Posted March 7, 2015 Report Share Posted March 7, 2015 Jim, You refer to a router control. Ray's site refers to a speed control. Are they the same thing? I think I'm confusing myself, and Ray! Thanks, Janice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunningThreads Posted March 7, 2015 Report Share Posted March 7, 2015 Janice It is the same thing. In the US you can go to a store like Harbor Freight tools and buy a router speed control for about $25 but I haven't seen them here anywhere near that cheap. Jim is a master at finding alternative solutions for his problems. He put the M bobbin in an Ultimate 2 that cost him about a hundred dollars, not possible according to APQS without changing the gearbox. Nigel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaniceC Posted March 7, 2015 Report Share Posted March 7, 2015 Thanks Nigel, and Jim, and Deb, Sorry to be so stupid! I was getting myself confused with foot control, and speed control, and router control. Obviously, not my area of expertise. Thanks again, Janice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb34285 Posted March 8, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2015 No Janice, don't ever think your being stupid! I was a little confused with the "router" term too- ended up calling and talking to Ray as Jim had suggested. You must have placed your order right before me as he told me he just sold his last one right before I called. He said he had not sold these in awhile and all of a sudden he had all this interest. He is going to order some more in to build more bobbin winders, Best of luck, Debbir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cagey Posted March 8, 2015 Report Share Posted March 8, 2015 I found the first speed controller at Harbor Freights website as Nigel suggested. The second one came from the QuiltTech. The two look rather similar. Cagey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb34285 Posted March 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2015 That's a great source for those that already have a bobbin winder and want to control the speed- I am assuming you just plug your industrial bobbin winder into the router control- otherwise I think Ray has a very fair price at quilt tech. Thanks for that info! Debbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cagey Posted March 18, 2015 Report Share Posted March 18, 2015 This is from the APQS website. Bobbin winder The key to consistent tension is consistently wound bobbins. The Turbo Bobbin Winder (only offered with Millennium and Freedom machines) is a high-quality industrial bobbin winder that evenly and quickly loads your bobbins with reliable tension. Load your own bobbins with thread that matches your specific needs so you can focus on the quilting process. Our Lucey, Lenni and George machines are equipped with a Sidewinder Deluxe bobbin winder. While so far I have not truly had any issues with the sidewinder bobbin winder that came with my George, I have to wonder if the sidewinder is truly the contributing factor with some tension issues? At a number of websites and in a few books, it was suggested if you are having tension issues or thread breaks, that you should actually wind your bobbin thread more slowly to prevent thread stretch. The sidewinder while a cheap piece of equipment standing next an APQS machine, it does wind the thread rather slowly. I for one have not had an issue with the sidewinder so far, except for the fact it seems so cheaply made when I use it. Once I changed my upper thread routing, it seems rather easy to balance tension. The APQS winder is a high speed winder. If thread stretch is the factor that causes bottom tension to continually change, why is this not a factor with the APQS winder that only runs at high speed? Cagey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neher-in-law5 Posted March 18, 2015 Report Share Posted March 18, 2015 I have the turbo winder that came with my George (the changed to the sidewinder after I had mine). I haven't had a lot of tension and thread breaking issues. In all fairness, I quilt for myself and not others so the volume of use might be different. I did add additional guides to George to help with the thread whipping that could catch on things. Mine has been working well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb34285 Posted March 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2015 Hi Cagey, How did you change the upper threading ? Deb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ffq-lar Posted March 18, 2015 Report Share Posted March 18, 2015 While so far I have not truly had any issues with the sidewinder bobbin winder that came with my George, I have to wonder if the sidewinder is truly the contributing factor with some tension issues? The APQS winder is a high speed winder. If thread stretch is the factor that causes bottom tension to continually change, why is this not a factor with the APQS winder that only runs at high speed? Cagey I think that it isn't the speed of the winder, but how consistent the speed is. The pre-wound bobbins that work so well with high-speed commercial applications are hard as a rock. They are wound consistently tight from first inch to last and are used by longarmers and in commercial embroidery applications. If you use the sidewinder and your bobbins are hard, you have a consistent winding of thread at one "tightness" and a good result. If your bobbins are spongy, the winding is too loose and you'll have inconsistent tension as you empty the bobbin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neher-in-law5 Posted March 19, 2015 Report Share Posted March 19, 2015 Thanks, Linda. That is a good explanation and knowledge to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb34285 Posted April 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 24, 2015 Hi all, Just a little belated update ... Got my new bobbin winder from Ray at quiltech - works great. I had to decrease the tension a little ( threads were breaking while winding). Basically looks like gammill bobbin winder on a finished natural wood board. Watch the YouTube on the gammill winder for good "how to use" video- works the same Best, Debbie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RunningThreads Posted April 24, 2015 Report Share Posted April 24, 2015 Thanks for posting the update Debbie. Nigel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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