happyquilter Posted October 11, 2009 Report Share Posted October 11, 2009 I have just started using a pantograph design and have been breaking needles when I approach a center seam as in a four patch. I am a newbie although I have owned my Liberty for a while. For a long time I have just free motioned and stippled. Free motioning I have usually avoided the heavier seams. I am using a 4.0 singer needle with King tut on top (40 wt) and prewound superior bobbin. It seems to happen even if I am going slow. Can anyone tell me how to stop this? I have made a small twin and have broken 6 needles. Also can anyone advise me on needles? Should I go thicker or thinner or change brands?? Any advice would be helpful... Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quilting Heidi Posted October 11, 2009 Report Share Posted October 11, 2009 Oh that is very odd. Are you seams thicker than normal? I have stitched over some really heavy seams and I've not had this problem. I use 3.5 - 4.0 almost all the time. I was going to suggest you had a dull needle but if you've broken that many I can't believe that. My guess would be that it is the needle flex and the movement of the head but that is only a guess. Hopefully Dawn will hop on this one. I'll bet she'll come up with a suggestion. Oh one thought is your hopping foot catching on the seam at all? If so I'd start by raising it a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyquilter Posted October 11, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2009 No Just a normal quilt made of 4 patches on point. It is a practice quilt and I have been trying to do things other than stipple. The hopping foot does not seem to be catching on the seam. Um, How do I check for Needle flex??? Is this somewhere in the manual? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheri Butler Posted October 11, 2009 Report Share Posted October 11, 2009 I have another question...by chance, is this quilt assembled with a serger? If so, the seams get too bulky with all that thread and can cause needles to break. I do NOT quilt any quilt that has been assembled with a serger. A few months ago, I had to turn down a lady who had 11 quilt tops, as they all were assembled by a serger. Dont know if the rest of you have this issue or not, but I avoid it like the plague. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quilting Heidi Posted October 11, 2009 Report Share Posted October 11, 2009 Neddle flex occurs as the needle goes down into the throat plate and skims the hook. If your movements are not smooth you could be pulling on the machine handle before the needle has had a chance to come up completely out of the quilt. The needle should not break with just a 4 patch seam unless there is extra thread or fabric in there. What kind of fabric are you quilting? I woul call Dawn Cavanaugh and see what she has to say. sorry I can't be of more help. Oh you might want to try a bigger needle and see if that helps with needle flex if that is what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witha'K'quilting Posted October 11, 2009 Report Share Posted October 11, 2009 Just another thought...are you in regulated stitch mode? If so, what length?...and are you moving the machine too fast for the stitch length that you selected. Maybe this is causing too much needle flex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbieJones Posted October 11, 2009 Report Share Posted October 11, 2009 Is your quilt sandwich to tight between the rollers? Try to let up on it and see if that helps. bj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LadyLake Posted October 12, 2009 Report Share Posted October 12, 2009 What kind of thread are you using in the bobbin? If you are using Bottom Line, it may be 'losing the tug of war' with the heavier King Tut (and thus more needle flex). Try a thicker thread in the bobbin such as Sew Fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyquilter Posted October 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2009 The quilt I am working on has normal seams. They are not serged. Yes, I am using the Stitch regulated mode. For the thread and needle combo I place it on either 9 or 10 for stitch length. I have liked the results when I stipple and really have never had this happen. Kristina, what stitch length do you use when in SR mode? I have been trying to move slowly as I go with this new pantograph. I will try also letting up on the tension between the rollers. Maybe I am making it too tight. Does sew fine come in prewound bobbin? If so, whom do you order them from? Ladies, thank you for all your input. I will try these suggestion. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witha'K'quilting Posted October 12, 2009 Report Share Posted October 12, 2009 I like to use 11-13 for SR mode. It works well for me. Too tight a quilt sandwich isn't good either as BJ said. I don't use prewounds..so can't help you there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happyquilter Posted October 12, 2009 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2009 Me again. I loosened the tension between the rollers and while this does seem to help I am still breaking needles. Broke another finishing the quilt. I do notice that the hopper foot is brushing up against the seam and this may be the cause. How do I adjust/ raise the hopper foot on my Liberty??? Could not find this in the manual. Maybe I am missing something? PS. My mood is no longer relaxed:( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njquiltergirl Posted October 12, 2009 Report Share Posted October 12, 2009 Hi. I have a Liberty also and, like most LA quilters, have had difficulty with thick seam intersections but not needle breaking. A few things to look at: Go slowly over seams. Do not over-tighten the quilt sandwich. I'd go with a thinner thread, like a So Fine on top, and use the same weight in the bobbin just to make it easier. Try a new 4.0 needle. Do you have a base expander on? Take it off, see if that helps. I think needle breaks are because you are moving the machine too fast over the thick seams...or you have a bad batch of needles...or your timing is a bit off and the seams are slowing it down - making it worse. If it was just the thickness or hardness of the seams, the machine would strain to get through the bulk. Good luck! I hope this helps. Lisa APQS Liberty NW NJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnCavanaugh Posted October 12, 2009 Report Share Posted October 12, 2009 Sorry to hear about your needle breakages. Drat! Also sorry I wasn't on the Forum yesterday...we had record "low" high temps in Iowa yesterday so it forced me into freezing several dozen ears of sweet corn for the winter months ahead:)! When a needle breaks, it's usually for one of these reasons: [*] bad needle [*] moving the machine too quickly (causes the needle to pull toward the hook and smash into it) [*] bulky seams (puts drag on the needle, deflecting it and causing it to either hit the throat plate or the hook) [*] timing out of alignment [*] strong thread pulling the needle (King Tut may do it occasionally, but not frequently [*] quilt top too tight (again, this pulls on the needle) [*] rare, but can happen...needle bar is bent Because you have had several breakage occurrances, I'd start with checking your timing before you jump into your next quilt. Review the section in the manual called "hook maintenance and timing", or send me an email and I can email the document back to you. The appendix will walk you through the four main steps for evaluating timing, including: * Checking needle depth * Checking hook rotation * Evaluating hook clearance * Adjusting the hook retaining finger We want to make sure that everything is set mechanically before diagnosing other potential causes, like the quilt tautness, seam thickness, etc. To check you hopping foot height, turn the flywheel by hand until the needle is as low as it can go. Then see if you can slide a business card under the hopping foot at that point. If you can't, the foot is too low. (Sometimes, with bulky seams or thick batting, you should raise the foot a smidgeon--the manual has an appendix for that or I can send that info to you, too.) With bulky seams (and especially combined with King Tut) a 4.5 needle will help reduce breakage. You also asked if So Fine comes in a pre-wound bobbin. To my knowledge, it does not. But if it DID, you'd find it on the Superior Threads website: www.superiorthreads.com. Feel free to call or email me, and we'll work it out together. We want to make sure things are right for your next project! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quilting Heidi Posted October 12, 2009 Report Share Posted October 12, 2009 See I knew Dawn would give you great advice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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