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New APQS Bliss System


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Cheryl,

I agree that companies have a right to improve their product and that most things over time will become obsolete. I suspect, if Bliss is as great as it's supposed to be, that it will very soon be an intregal part of the standard APQS system, not just an option. And I plan on giving Bliss a serious look and am not ruling out that I will buy it. However, the expense is kinda overwhelming and I'm just venting a little.

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Originally posted by HeidiKaisand

Clarification --

I just wanted to clarify that when it was mentioned that the lexan might have to be shaved, we meant the width, not the height or length. And this would only be for older tables.

Please let me know if there are any further questions that I can answer.

Hi, Heidi,

Thanks for the clarification. I have a 2005 Millie with the lexan table. Is that considered an "older" table? And how does one go about shaving lexan?

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Originally posted by yankiequilter

Originally posted by lisae

This from an email I just received:

"Table Tops – Clear table top MAY be okay, but may have to be shaved down a bit as it sits down “in” the table. Black table tops are fine."

It doesn't sound like our pattern boards, whether they be Circle Lord, Quiltazoid, R&S, or some other, can be used with the new system. I wish someone from APQS would jump in here and clarify this for us. I can't imagine APQS would design the new rails and carriage and make them in such a fashion that the boards could not be used.

Carmen -- It doesn't sound like there will be a problem with the large pattern boards. The plastic may be a bit narrower but the quilting surface should be about the same. There may have to be an adjustment for the height of the carriage though.

Question: I know the wheels on the carriage are new but what about the wheels on the machine head? Will those be changed out? I am assuming the bracket for the wheels on the head will be replaced also??? Thanks

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Originally posted by HeidiKaisand

Clarification --

I just wanted to clarify that when it was mentioned that the lexan might have to be shaved, we meant the width, not the height or length. And this would only be for older tables.

Please let me know if there are any further questions that I can answer.

Heidi, -- can you clarify exactly what is included in the upgrade? From what I'm reading, for those of us with "old" lexan tables it would include (1) two new rails that run the entire length of the table (2) new slimmed down carriage (3) new wheels and axles for machine and carriage (4) new encoders. But does it also include a new black tabletop, or is cutting the lexan our only option if we have an "old" (2008 or older?) table.

Which brings to mind a few more questions. (a) If the tabletop width is a little less than our lexan tops so that it can fit between the rails, will the new rails attach easily to our existing legs, in the same drilled holes? (B) As many have asked and, as far as I can see have not received a definitive answer, is there room vertically for the pattern board systems and if not can the carriage be raised to accomodate them? This is a biggy that needs to be addressed, as many of us have invested a lot of money in these systems. (d) how does one cut the lexan -- table saw? (e) How will the new system affect the vertical and horizontal locking systems on the Millie and Freedom. And finally, a question I asked earlier, (f) will the new system give me the FINE movement control that will improve the ability to do and appearance of very small quilting like microstippling and tiny feathers?

I realize this is a lot of questions, but I only ask because I'm seriously interested in possibly investing in this system, and need to know the answers to questions that I feel APQS should have anticipated before introducing a new product. It creates anxiety when we ask and don't get clear confident answers.

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I have been reading these Bliss threads and everyday more and more info is comming to light, not all good.

For instance, why is it that the issues of moveability, drag, not being able to do tighter (micro) quilting been discussed, with real solutions? I have to admit I am also guilty of this because I have had my machine for 5 years and one of the reasons why I don't do alot of freemotion/ custom is because of this problem. But instead of addressing this issue as perhaps a flaw in the table/carriage/wheels I assumed it had to do more with me than with the APQS product. Yes APQS is known for it's "smart bobbin" stitch quality but without the ease of movement of the machine, the stitch quality doesn't matter so much.

Edgerider wheels...by the way some were talking about these wheels, they made it seem like this was the "fix" to the movement/drag issues it appears that most of us do have. but in light of this Bliss announcement it seems that this might not be the case, since people were still unhappy after they got the wheels to the point they were thinking of selling their machines.

APQS needs better PR/marketing know how when it comes to new products, announcements, and handling questions.

There is nothing more frustrating to us the consumer than to be only given 1/2 the info. I have never heard of any company taking pre orders for a product that isn't near or at the release date of the product (the APQS computerized system a few years back comes to mind) it was a big huge teaser like the bliss, even had a link on the APQS home page for a while than absolute quiet, no one will answer the questions about what ever became of that idea or even if the people were refunded their down payment? BTW that also had no pics of the product. Why all the build of of the Biss system, and pre orders if no one is ready to show pics of it? Why in such a hurry to release this news that APQS didn't handle the announcement better about which machines were to benifit from it? And now it appears that not all of the details are even out there. Because each day we get a little more info as if they/APQS are doing this on the fly without much pre thought/plan/thinking ahead.

For instance the lexion table tops...bad idea to charge the customer $3K for the upgrade and then tell them BTW you have to "Shave" your current top down to make it fit! You got to be kidding:mad: Most of us don't have the equiptment to do this. Nor would want to do this.

And how do we know that this is not going to be another "idea" that ends up in the trash can, like the computerized system?

I think APQS should take a step back, regroup, have a finished complete product, then get a marketing team in place that can put together a stradegy that excites the consumer instead of raising concerns/questions that no one seems to have thought through enough to have an answer for. Only this response "oh, good question, I'll check into that and get back to you". These "questions" should have already been addressed in the production phase of this product, APQS should have already asked themselves these questions when they were creating this new product...it should not be after the fact.

Ok, I have said what I needed to say. I hope APQS will clear up all of this mess and come back with Pics, a clear game plan and a well thought out marketing stradegy that is well thought out from the get go and not on the fly...which is bad business.

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Joann. I have the Edgerider wheels and felt that they really helped me in my control of Frogger. I also see so many beautiful award winning quilts done by so many...Birgit, Marilyn, Claudia to only name a couple...and they do not have Bliss. This tells me that it is very possible to make the proper adjustments to the machines that need to be made in order to have the fine control required! I am keeping my $3k and will save it to use towards a second longarm in the future! :)

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Originally posted by Stagecl

Every manufacturer up dates and improves their equipment. Everything we purchase becomes obsolete no matter it is. We are not obligated to purchase the upgrade and our machines will still work fine. How does a company stay in business if it doesn't evolve?

One can still own a dial up phone and it still works

I am sure that the other companies will come up with retro fits for our quilting toys. It too is just a matter of time because they want to be able to sell their gadgets to the quilters that have the new machines

Yes, I would love to upgrade, but will my CQ work on the new rails? If not, I'll have to wait until Stan can change the pulleys and cables for my CQ. I will expect to pay for the upgrade there too.

OK, at the risk of being politically incorrect, posting too much on this subject and being considered a pest by APQS, let's look at this another way. If Bliss is wonderful, it will become part of the regular APQS system and manufacturers of add-ons will eventually make retrofits. However, in the meantime -- new customers who see that the "improved" system (which they will feel they are entitled to considering the big $$$$$ they are investing) doesn't work with computerized or big board systems, they could very likely buy elsewhere. I understand the need that APQS had to keep this under wraps, but I don't understand why they didn't take these add-on systems into consideration. And perhaps they did and we just haven't heard the answers yet?

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Thanks Joann -- at least I'm not alone in expressing my concerns on how Bliss is being rolled out. Don't get me wrong, I love my machine and I love APQS or I wouldn't have bought my Freedom and I wouldn't be here posting. But not getting straight answers and being told to contact our reps with questions, some who obviously didn't know any more than we did before the announcement, is not the way to instill confidence in a product or company.

While I'm at it, I'll mention one more thing that didn't sit well and then I'll stop -- I received several u2u's from a rep who obviously was "in the know", strongly encouraging me to (paraphrased) buy now, put down your deposit with me and reserve your place in line to receive Bliss! This rep lives nowhere near me. Ok, I'll be quiet now, because I have probably just jumped off the pc cliff!

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I am lucky enough to live in Des Moines and can just run over to the showroom whenever I want to. In fact, we have our long arm guild meeting there once a month. (What a blessing!!) I own two APQS machines and love them both. I went in to the showroom to buy thread and asked about the Bliss. When I was shown this new feature, I was blown away. It truly is like quilting on air. I have tried ER wheels and currently use the new gray APQS wheels. I am able to do intense custom work on my machines, but I know that this new feature is going to make intricate work easier on my brain and my body. (Less shoulder strain.) I am so excited about it that I had trouble sleeping last night. I do a lot of applique quilts for customers and this is going to make the process of going around applique easier and more accurate. It is truly blissful and I don't even make one cent for saying so. (I do not work for APQS.) My only question is: Do I add Bliss to my Liberty or upgrade to a larger machine with Bliss. As soon as I decide, the order is going in.

Michele

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Originally posted by Mary Beth

Yes, I agree, after giving this some thought, I have decided to forget about the new system. I would love to have it, but selling my machine, and getting the new Millie with the lights and quilt glide, would end up costing me about $9000. Not gonna do it. I will purchase the Edgeriders or just sell my machine and not quilt at all. I just can't afford that upgrade. After adding up the cost, I started thinking of all the other things I would rather have, then I started thinking about what I could really get if I sold everything. Hum....then I would have time to piece and I could send my tops to you all to quilt. I think I will just stay put for a while.

MaryBeth -- If Bliss is all it's said to be, I wonder if Quilt Guide is even necessary any longer (trying to get some answers on that one)? And if APQS doesn't come up with a retrofit for LED's, I'll figure out something on my own. Heck, maybe I should get to work on that, create an add-on light system and make some money!! Anyway, IF Bliss is really wonderful and IF it is still possible to use patternboards, CQ, IQ etc., and IF some of our concerns are addressed soon, it may be well worth it to go with the Bliss

upgrade alone without buying a whole new machine. Don't get discouraged and throw the baby out with the bathwater too soon. In spite of what I consider some APQS "goofs" in rolling this out, it might end up being a very good product that will be very beneficial to all us, whether we quilt for customers or ourselves. Let's wait and see.

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Originally posted by mrsbishwit

Edgerider wheels...by the way some were talking about these wheels, they made it seem like this was the "fix" to the movement/drag issues it appears that most of us do have. but in light of this Bliss announcement it seems that this might not be the case, since people were still unhappy after they got the wheels to the point they were thinking of selling their machines.

Hi, Joann,

Maybe I am the lone dissenter here...but I spent the money and put EdgeRiders on my Millie...took them off and sold them. The wheels raised the machine head so high that the bolts to raise the leveler bar had to be replaced. And no, the EdgeRiders did not relieve the drag in certain spots on the table. So I went back to the APQS wheels and things are much better. I also took most of the tension off the truss bolts in the middle of the table. That seemed to help more than anything. But let me tell you, I am an constantly tweaking the wheels, trying to find that sweet spot.

And I totally agree with you about "shaving" the table down...what happens if I ruin the table trying to shave it down? Now I am out $3K PLUS the cost of a new table top.

Just my two cents worth...I think this new table design might be a good idea but there are way too many unanswered questions right now.

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Michele,

Thanks for posting your positive experience with the Bliss system. I am very excited about it also. I am also a Liberty owner and was pondering the same as you....upgrade Miss Liberty or go for a new fully upgraded Millie. I don't really "need" to do either. I just want to. Don't you just love exciting new improvements? I will send you a U2U.

Carol

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Bliss is very exciting and with every new product there are lots of questions and we are glad to answer all of them. I'm going to post a picture today on my apqs blog so that you can all see the new carriage. Then tomorrow I'm headed to Chicago and will be taking video and more pictures to share with you all. I'm going to spend some time ready through this thread and try to make one list of questions and answer the questions in one reply.

Check out my APQS blog for a photo of the Bliss carriage. http://www.apqs.com/artists_heidi_stitches.php?id=72

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thanks Hiedi. I look forward to test driving when I can. I want to see the videos, but understand this isn't something that can be easily photographed.

Speaking just for myself, I would appreciate it if we could limit this thread to information, questions as they come in etc. I think I have a thorough understanding of some folks frustrations, speculations etc....

PeggyB

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Perhaps we all need to step back and take a breath...

I suspect this new system was not to be launched yet and it was leaked early. That's why there is sparse info and no photos yet. The home office must be buzzing trying to find the time (with major shows this week and next month) to keep us all happy.

Let's give it a month, don't overreact, remember that if what you have is working well for you there may not be a need for the latest-and-greatest add-on. Let's see where this all goes.

APQS does not have to engineer new things to be compatible with after-market tools and toys. The various companies will be the ones to make sure their product works. It's always been that way. That being said, don't throw all your goodies away--let it calm down and see where we are first.

I'm as intrigued as the rest of you with this new goodie--but I have quilts to quilt in the meantime on a perfectly good longarm--with brown wheels and no micro-drive, QuiltGlide, CL, QZ, or Hartley products. And no rice bags or foam sheets. Just me backed up by classes, books, DVDs, and chocolate. I use pattern boards on occasion, stencils every now and then, and pantos only in an emergency. That's the way I roll, er, stitch!

So I will wait and see--if we all order tomorrow, imagine what the waiting time will be!:D

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ditto! I like excitement and anticipation over new things available and coming, but sometimes we need to work in the slow cooker time frame instead of the microwave timing.

Can you imagine the headaches and tension (not on the machines) that is happening at APQS in trying to get ready for shows and to also have to feel the pressure of answering questions that they are getting bombarded with?

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Being a relative newbie here, I probably should be quiet, but I don't think the Quilt Glide feature and the Bliss system are at all related. The Bliss system effects how your machine glides around on the the table. The Quilt Glide system effects how your stitch regulator runs, two completely different applications.

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