Peggy (SewAsylum) Posted October 4, 2013 Report Share Posted October 4, 2013 Hi, I am a relatively new quilter. I was all ready to buy a long arm. I picked out the one I wanted and my husband had agreed we could afford it. I went to the store yesterday and test drove one to make sure. You see, I have a pain disability, my neck is all screwed together, and I can't work anymore. Sewing, quilting, and embroidery, as well as other crafts, keep me sane. Well, 30 minutes on that long arm gave me so much pain that I was shocked. My neck and shoulders hurt very badly, even still today. I am so disappointed I have been crying off and on all day. I wanted it so badly. Sitting won't help, the pain is in my neck, and it is usually better for me to stand. I will have to continue to quilt on my embroidery machine, which I am lucky to have. I guess I just wanted to tell some people who would understand how I feel, how disappointed I am. If anyone has any suggestions they will be most welcome. Thanks for listening, and I hope to post better stuff soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Have you considered a APQS George? I'm only asking because you mention you quilt on your embroidery machine. I have a blown disc in my neck that gives me a lot of trouble. Some days I can only spend a short amount of time quilting at the longarm, other days more. I found doing pantos from the back of the machine is harder on my neck than doing custom quilting at the front of the machine. I love to quilt and don't get much time to do it because of my work schedule, so when I do get the chance I push through the pain and discomfort and pay for it for days. I have noticed in the past if I quilt a little bit each day at the longarm as time goes on I am quilting longer periods of time before the pain gets too bad. I wish you all the best!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ffq-lar Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Is there a way you can work with your PT professional to find a position that will allow you to quilt for a bit with rest in between? If you can work it out, there are many ways to adjust the longarm tables--especially up and down. Many find relief from spine/neck pain by adjusting up a bit or down a bit every half hour or less. The hydraulic lifts are wonderful and might be your solution. If you can't bend and reach without pain, find designs that allow you to quilt narrower areas of the quilting field that are close to the front. I'm so sorry that your dream is on hold and hope you can find a solution that allows you to quilt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quilting Heidi Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I wonder if it was the height of the machine that cause some of the pain. I have a hydraulic lift on my machine so that I can raise it to the right height. Sometimes just a little tweak and it makes all the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srichardson Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Were you holding the handles with a death grip? It is an easy thing to do when you first start out. Could that have caused some of your pain? Don't give up on your dream. Try different machines with different style handles, some are more ergonomic than others. As Linda and Heidi mentioned the wrong height can cause issues. Where are you located, are there any shows in your area that would allow you to try different machines? Good luck with your search and welcome to the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butterfly Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 You may have been tense....and that makes a difference. I have a lot of pain too and can often sew for only 20 minutes a day. Some days not at all. It's so disappointing and so I can relate to your discouragement over this. I hope you can figure out a way to make it work! Also, the shape of the handles make a difference. I switched out the apqs handles for vertical handles that someone made for me. Was a big help. Jess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peggy (SewAsylum) Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Thank you so much everyone for these tips and encouragement. I am not giving up yet. I will look into all of these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shirleyl Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 They call it a belly bar, but mine has to be a boob bar or my neck kills me. Another alternative is getting a computerized system. My friend had neck surgery and she ended up adding a computer. Now she runs three machines at a time. Her long arm, embroidery and dsm. She still free hands but the majority of her stuff is done computerized. Just an idea, you can freehand when needed or wanted and let the computer do the rest. Shirley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peggy (SewAsylum) Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I can't afford the computer system. Besides I want to actually DO it, not have a computer do it. I want to do the actual sewing. I want to paint with thread. Thanks for the idea, tho. My husband thinks a sit down long arm would be harder on me because I would have to push the quilt around. I, however, think that pushing the machine around would be harder on me. You must be pushing several pounds around, even tho it glides, don't you think? With a sit down machine, the quilt is supported by the table and you just slide it, right? I am thinking that if I sat, and had the table at the proper height, as several of you suggested, even a little high, a boob bar as Shirley suggested, that I may be able to do it. After all, I do sit and use my regular sewing machine, even tho I have to limit my sessions. Again, I appreciate everyone's input very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darlene Epp Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 You said you stopped by "the store" to try out a machine. I'm assuming here that it wasn't an APQS machine. Try to get to where you can spend some time on an APQS Lenni with the Bliss rail system. You'll be surprised at how little effort it takes to move the machine. It's like running a hot knife through butter! Don't give up on your dream yet. I too have major neck and shoulder issues and do a combination of freehand, ruler work and computerized quilting. It doesn't have to be all or nothing with the computer. Use it where it will do the most creative job with the least amount of effort, and add your personal touch with a bit of freehand and ruler work. I limit myself to 20 minutes at a time; sometimes less. I find I can get more done if I quilt for shorter periods of time. As for the handles, I have Millennium machines with the ergo handles and couldn't quilt without them. I've modified and adjusted mine (very simple fix) so they're adjustable "on the fly". If you want them in an upright position, all you have to do is lift them up. Those handles alone have kept me "in the game". Without them, and Bliss, and a computerized system, I'd be sitting on the sidelines, watching my dream float away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sewingpup Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I am a newbie too. And I have Fibromyalgia and some osteo arthritis. I am having a bit of a pain problem also. I need to problem solve this. I had a smaller nine inch machine on a frame and did not have as much neck and shoulder issues. I am a shorter type person at 5' 4". I find that stretching to reach things including attaching the quilt on my 26 inch Lucey is a "stretch" that I can feel. What I know is that often times when I start doing something new, I do tense up more and the muscles that I am using have not been used in that way exactly before and I probably will adjust some, just like when doing a new exercise or doing some chore that involves manual labor. So...what I know right now is that I need to take more breaks, that I need to focus on relaxing those neck and shoulder muscles periodically, even might use a timer set for 10 minutes so I remember that....I need to attach enough quilts so I know that process and figure out have to do it with less tightening up of my muscles. I may have to lower my whole frame as low as it can go to go and raise the handles a bit so I can still stand straight. I do have bliss...I am glad of that.....while I really wanted the 26 inches, I am thinking at this point, Lenni might have been a better choice. I also did go to a PT to ask what I can and can't do and was given some stretches and strenthening exercises. I am going to problem solve this.....I agree with going and trying differant machines including Lenni on bliss keeping in mind...that it really does take doing it for a while to get comfortable with a machine and develope the muscle control to do it. And I really would if possible, consult with a physical therapist and/or your doc. Other options for me might be to get one of those saddle stools to sit on and already I am planning on working in just the space that I can comfortably even it does mean rolling the quilt a bit more....I also have readjusted what my plan is...now I am planning on quilting a bit, then going upstairs and maybe piecing a bit, or even reading or watching some silly show....hey I am retired let us know how it goes....Lin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimerickson Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Petmom: I think you should try at least 2 things. First try a power lift table. Moving the machine up or down makes a big difference in the comfort level when quilting. As Heidi says, a small adjustment in height can make all the difference. The second is a saddle stool. I find quilting from my saddle stool so much easier on my back and shoulders. In my opinion, moving the machine would be easier on your body than moving the quilt. The machines move almost effortlessly, while you have to struggle to move the quilt. I do have to admit I've never sat and quilted on a sit down machine, so my opinion is a bit uninformed, but I think the physics behind the movements favors my opinion. Don't give up quite yet. Do more testing. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cathyh Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I went from free motion quilting on a DSM just because of my neck and shoulder pain. It took some practice learning to use my Millie without developing back pain, and the two things Jim mentioned are what helped me. I got a saddle stool, and I lifted my table. I don't have a power lift and would highly recommend getting one. It was not that easy for my old bones to raise table and get it level, but it helped so much. I am dealing with osteoarthritis now in my hands which is slowing me down, but I will figure some way to keep on quilting. You don't say which machines you have tried, but i would bet there is one out there that will be right for you. I hope you don't give up on your dream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheagatzi Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Did you test drive the APQS line petmom? Everyone has fantastic ideas here. I would think that the main thing to check is your posture. The APQS machines are so great because the height is adjustable (if you get the hydraulic lifts) with the push of a button, up a little or a lot, down a little or a lot. The handles are also adjustable so lowering/raising your handles, or gripping them in a different way can make a world of difference. I love the handles for that fact - there are many ways to hold onto the machine, and that can make a big difference in your posture. I would hire an ergonomic specialist for a consultation - have them watch you on the machine and get them to adjust the machine height and handle height to what would be appropriate for your situation. If you're going to spend the money on a longarm machine, spend the money and have someone come with you and see how they can tweak the fit of the machine for you. And... believe it or not, that death grip in beginners is very true. I haven't experienced pain like you have, but I have experienced fatigue and stiffness. Once you become comfortable with your machine you begin to relax and your movements become more natural and fluid. Is there someone in your area that you can rent from for a few sessions - try out all the different variables mentioned in this thread and then you can make your decision confidently? Someone mentioned the sit down George machine - one that I thought would be a good alternate for your situation as well. Don't give up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peggy (SewAsylum) Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Thank you, everyone, these are great ideas for me to try. There is no APQS dealer in my state, that I can find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quiltingjoyful51 Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Sorry there isn't an APQS dealer in your area. Our machine are so much lighter than the others. Maybe you could check for a quilter that has one in your area. Have you checked the site for a road shoe in your area? Wish you were close to me I would be glad to let you play on my machine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmkeindl1 Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Where are you? If there's not a dealer in your area, surely there is someone else on this forum nearby? Try to not get frustrated and just "try something else" as all the others have said, sitting down, higher, lower, and the 'death grip' is a real thing! I feel badly for all of you with constant pain! I've had bronchitis (again) for a couple days and now I remember to not feel so sorry for myself because others out there deal with illness all the time and my coughing will go away! Keep smiling! Fake it till you Make it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katydids Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 APQS owners are very generous with their time and showing their machines. I have always found that to be true. If you connect with a dealer near your state, or the home office, we can track down an owner that has a machine suitable to you that you could go visit. don't go with a "brand" just because it is nearby. Like Darlene said, the Lenni on a Bliss table would move effortlessly. The Lenni is only 34 lbs and with the Bliss table, you would feel like it is on ice skates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darlene Epp Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I had to give up teaching my 3 day classes because of Fibromyalgia. What most people don't realize is that it's very easy for us to overdo it, because we don't feel the pain at the time of the doing. It's the next day, or a few hours later that we get hit with debilitating muscle pain that doesn't stay put. If the pain would just stay in one spot, you could learn to deal with it, add heat, or whatever. But for me, the pain would be excruciating in my left upper arm for maybe 10 minutes, then it would jump to my right thigh, or my calf muscles, then back to a forearm. Stretching is thought by many PTs to be the answer, but in many of us, stretching causes cramps. Doing ANYTHING becomes a crap shoot because you never know how it will affect you the next day. BUT, there is hope. I went from being virtually bedridden to starting my own business, buying a longarm machine, quilting for customers, starting a mail order business, teaching at big shows and in my home. I hesitate to give any "medical" advice, because fibromyalgia patients are like head injury patients. No two are the same. (I have experience with both.) My daughter's best friend at the time was a nurse in a cardiac hospital. She really wanted to get into something that was preventative, instead of caring for people 'after the trauma'. At the time, there was a multi-level company called "Enrich" that she got involved with. She put me on an herbal regimen and within 4 days I forgot to take my prescribed medicine. I haven't taken it since. I feel like this product saved my life and my sanity! Enrich eventually merged with Rexall and is now called Unicity. She put me on several herbs, but the one I continue to take is called Phytopath. It cleared up much of the "brain fog" that is associated with FM and really lessened the muscle pain. I had quite a few good years, but I've noticed as I get older, I have to be more careful. I've learned to say "NO" to people, in a nice way. I've had to tell family that the "Epp Hotel" is closed to all but invited friends and family. (I currently have TWO family members staying here.) AND they know they have to change the sheets themselves when they leave. I got to the point where I realized that if I didn't take care of me, no one else would. My family still doesn't understand what FM is and how it affects us. I've been accused of being selfish, "not generous", self-absorbed, etc. etc. etc. I came to the realization that those character traits were true of the persons that were doing the accusing; they were not true of me, and try as I might, no one wanted to learn about FM or how it affects the body and the brain. So I just don't try to educate them anymore. I just say "NO" when I know I can't or don't want to deal with the aftermath of saying Yes. You are welcome to contact me privately if you wish. I have loading a quilt down to a fine science, without reaching and stretching. There are probably many things I could help you with. Handle position is VERY important, and when I'm freehanding, I change hand positions about every 20 seconds. I can help you make your handles so they move like butter, without touching the adjusting screws. I hate to see anyone give up on their dream because of pain and physical limitiations. You were given the dream for a reason, and it wasn't to torment you! LOL eppd at telus dot net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ffq-lar Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Bless you, Darlene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sewingpup Posted October 5, 2013 Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Darlene, It is hard when friends and family do not "get" fibro or chronic pain issues. My sister who I love dearly, is always telling me to "push on" and finish whatever job it is we are doing....of course I know with fibro...that just doesn't work unless you have several days to do nothing.....so I just tell her...that I work best taking breaks and I know she works best just pushing on.....and leave it at that....I think with chronic pain, it takes a lot of patience....and trial and error to figure out how to do things....I am glad I am getting a bit old so I don't remember as clearly when I was young and could "just do things". although I sometimes do forget that I am getting old and try and do something I can't do so good now....like getting up down on the floor and then trying to get up....takes a bit more thought and effort now. Oh, looking back, I would like to think I would be more thoughtful as to what I am dong to my body if I were younger...which of course I am not... Lin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peggy (SewAsylum) Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 Thanks Darlene, and everyone. I was diagnosed with fibromyalgia, but now a different dr. says I do not have it. My neck is all screwed together and hurts 24/7. I am wondering if the height of the table was a big factor, because I know it was too low for me. I am still hurting terribly badly today. I am so touched that so many people reached out to me with ideas. It means a lot to me. I am going to keep thinking about this and trying to solve it. All your ideas are great and worth trying. I may hold off on the long arm and try FM on my home sewing machine so I don't make a vey big financial mistake, and I am going to continue to look for a used one, so I don't have to spend so much, in case it doesn't work out. I do have an acquaintance that has a long arm and I am going to go to her house and have her explain things to me and see if I can try again. Today I decided to just do my applique, on my quilt, by hand instead of machine. Since I have to sit and rest, this hand work will keep me busy for several days. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peggy (SewAsylum) Posted October 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2013 I know what you mean about family not always understanding pain issues. One of my sisters has been downright insulting to me about it. She won't even talk to me about it. I am supposed to, "be positive," 24 hours a day and never need to talk about it. I have learned to do what I need to do to take care of myself, and I have learned to not reach out to her for support. Thank goodness my husband is completely supportive and helps me every day to keep up with my house and my rescued pets. I am surprised to hear that so many people out there are in the same boat as I am. I am encouraged by the fact that you keep on quilting, and work around your pain issues. It is addicting, isn't it? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cathyh Posted October 6, 2013 Report Share Posted October 6, 2013 Second the blessings, Darlene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darlene Epp Posted October 7, 2013 Report Share Posted October 7, 2013 I've had some inquiries from several of you wanting to know about the product I've been taking. I had quite a large supply of a product called "Phytopath" and am nearing the end of it. Just went to reorder, and it's no longer available. The company used to have MANY products, but from what I can see, they are now only offering 2. VERY disappointing, as the Phytopath replenished the serotonin in the brain that is depleted in FM patients and accounts for the brain fog, sleep disorders etc. A new search begins! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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