bobbin question

[seakitten]

When I got my machine, it came with two different kinds of bobbins, aluminum & steel. They are slightly different in weight. Will the bobbin tension need to be adjusted when switching between these 2 kinds of bobbins? So far I have only been using one kind, cause I am scared to find out. Tension really stresses me out . . .

[ffq-lar]

Ask Santa for a Towa bobbin tension gauge for Christmas. You will alleviate so much aggravation and frustration from the beginning! It works with metal, plastic, and cardboard pre-wounds. Good luck to you in paradise, Catherine!

[RitaR]

Hi, I don\'t have any first hand info on the aluminum/steel bobbin issues, but have heard the steel seem to give just a slight edge.. Less backlash problems.. maybe because the aluminum are lighter, or could be because it\'s softer metal and may drag a bit more? I\'m just guessing on this. Must be a reason.. I am going go steel so I don\'t have to worry about the aluminum marks, or worry if I\'ll get black marks on my hands, yukkos built up in the machine, etc....

Hope someone pops in with a concrete answer.

RitaR

[Laurie]

I personally don\'t like the aluminum bobbins....I have them but don\'t use them. I think they do need a different tension adjustment because they are lighter.....

How is the quilting going? Are you all set up now?

[John Mitchell]

The aluminum bobbins weigh less so the bobbin tension is different than the steel bobbins. The aluminum drop test is about the same as with pre wounds. We have been in the business for almost 11 years and I have been repairing machines for over 8 years and I do not have a tension gauge. Why spend $75 for something I don’t need.

Physics would tell you that the aluminum bobbins would stop quicker then the steel bobbins (less mass). Less chance for backlash, however we don’t have the problem with steel bobbins. All APQS machines are now shipped with the aluminum bobbins. That said we only stock, sell and also use steel bobbins. Our clients request steel bobbins and we sell a lot of them. Janet and Mary prefer them, it may be what they are used to steel but that’s the story here at Country Lane Quilting.

John

[Jeanette]

Thank you John for your answer!!! I have been so tempted many times to post re \'why spend the money for something you don\'t need\' and also about \'why do you think you need to retime your machine"? But I am just a quilter. Nice to hear it coming from a knowledgable in the business person.

I really think that advice to re-time the machine every time we break a thread is wayyyyyyy overdone. My machine is older, uses three different needle sizes, etc. and has never been retimed. I have jammed it and broke needles, use all kinds of threads, etc. Problems are usually traced to operator error, never timing. What are your thoughts on this????

[DawnCavanaugh]

Hi Jeanette,

You directed your question about timing to John, but I thought I\'d jump in here, too.

APQS machines are "timed" very tightly to give you a superior stitch quality. In addition, the mechanisms are very durable, but not indestructable. Your machine is older and has never been re-timed; my machine is 14 years old, and has only been "re-timed" due to my injuring the poor thing twice.

Now, I have sent it back to the factory 5-6 times for a "go-through" during its lifetime, and I\'m sure it was checked and re-timed if necessary during those service visits. But you are right in that thread breakage is very rarely related to timing issues. Thread breakage is most commonly caused by:

[*] Poor quality thread

[*] Improper threading

[*] Imbalanced tension

[*] Needle heat or friction on fragile threads

[*] Different thread weights or types in top and bottom

[*] Bad needle (some needle eyes can have ridges)

[*] Grooves in the thread guides due to wear

[*] Burrs on the hook assembly from needle strikes or breaks

If a quilter breaks a needle, you can be sure there\'s a burr on the hook somewhere. There\'s an appendix in the manual that tells you exactly where to search on the hook assembly to check for burrs, and how to eliminate them.

If a needle gets "jammed" into the hook assembly, though, then the timing might be impacted, simply because the needle bar might slide inside its clamp as the machine attempts to cycle to the needle up or down position.

Often just switching to a new needle, checking for burrs on the hook assembly, and doing a "test run" will be all that is necessary to get up and running again.

Of course, I\'m "old school" too and that probably clouds my opinion, but a lot of adjustments can be accomplished with just a good understanding of the machine and how it works. Some people are just more confident having a gadget verify that what they are doing is "correct"; if it makes them feel better, that\'s okay, too. (I guess my bank examiner husband\'s "frugal" behavior is finally starting to rub off on me when it comes to buying extra gadgets !)

Have a wonderful holiday season!

[annlittle1]

Okay, well since I have to have every gadget that comes out, I bought the $75.00 gauge. But, what do I do? I check each bobbin with the gauge and then I do the drop test because I trust the drop test more than the gauge!!!

Maybe its because the only instructions that came with the gauge were in Chinese.

[ffq-lar]

Hi Phyllis,

Since you also do a drop test and trust that, next bobbin do the drop test first and get the tension where you like for that specific thread. THEN test the tension with the gauge (instructions to follow!) Write that number down and use it as a reference for every time you use that type of thread and you can stop doing both tests at some point!!

Towa Gauge Use

Place the bobbin in the case so the thread, when pulled, will spin the bobbin clockwise as you are holding it bobbin up. If you are using cardboard-sided pre-wounds, tear off the outside cardboard. Place the case, bobbin down into the gauge and snap it in--the bump at the top of the case will align with the holder at the top. Pull the thread with your left hand and wrap underneath and around the bottom pulley, up and to the left around the top pulley, and down and around to the left on the plastic guide at the bottom. With a smooth movement and constant speed, pull the thread to the left. The gauge face may jump a little, but you will get a general idea of a number. For pre-wound BL bobbins, my machine is happy with 17 to 20 on the gauge. Trial and error will show you your numbers and write them down on a little reminder chart for future reference.

Good luck and my all your stitching be perfect!!!

[Sparkle]

I used to have a love-hate relationship with my TOWA bobbin gauge. Like John, I thought what a waste of money! ---and quite frankly the fact that it seems to be the only semi good bobbin tension gauge out their for quilters to buy also bothers me a bit. I would like someone else to offer a really nice bobbin tension gauge. Very accurate and well constructed.

The Towa is way over priced, and really flimsy as compared to other "guages" or tools used in the industry. My husband has all types of gauges ---and they are so well built and very accurate. I wish the Towa was like those ---

The Towa is ---well this cheap lightweight plastic stuff, with a less than accurate bopping around meter inside the inexpensive housing. I keep thinking those little plastic wheely thinges are going to fall off some day! It also is very dependent on how well you "pull the thread" If you have been lifting your weights that day! or not---you can get some interesting readings!

However, since I have the money invested in this "gadget" I am making myself learn to use it as best I can. Thank you Linda! I\'m now getting a semi-static reading of approx. 18 to 20 on most of my aluminum bobbins. By the way---I personally love the aluminum bobbins! I gave away all my steel bobbins as soon as I found out how much I liked the aluminum ones!

And Thanks again Linda! I have started using my prewounds after you suggested I take off the outer cardboard casing. I have "Tow-anded" those to a approx. 20, or a tad bit more---and retain perfect tension until about the last bit of bobbin thread remains on them...then my tension starts to get a bit flaky...so, I replace them before the thread runs completely out now.

Well, that\'s my 2 cents on Towa and bobbins.

[seakitten]

Thanks for all the expert advice. I do have the Towa gauge, & like many of you I am not sure it is worth it, but it does sometimes lull me into a false sense of security. I know that there is no substitute for experience, I am practicing as much as I can & problems are definitely fewer.

Dawn, I did break a needle in the very first day or 2 that I had the machine, but could not find any damage. Maybe I don\'t know what to look for, & I KNOW I need new glasses. Should I look again? Sometimes the tension will just go flooey, but I think that has more to do with thread, or threading, issues, as Dawn pointed out.

[annlittle1]

Thanks, Linda, for the excellent instructions. I did figure out how to use it after staring at the tiny little diagram that I found on the side of the box. There was also a discussion on this forum several months ago that reassured me that I am doing it right. However, a number of times I\'ve used it and had to make an adjustment to get the bobbin to read correctly on the gauge, then when I did the drop test it wouldn\'t even drop. Tried the bobbins in the machine and the tension was way too tight. I adjusted them according to the drop test and they worked perfectly in the machine.

I think the accountant in me needs to see the number on the gauge, but I still do the drop test and if the results differ, I go with the drop test. Its silly, I know, to do both tests. Its just one of those personal quirks, I guess. DH would tell you I\'m very quirky!

[Quilting Heidi]

Phyllis,

Why do you do the drop test and get it perfect and then test it with the Towa gauge to get your number? That way you\'d be able to put it in the guage and not worry about the drop test. Just a thought. I think my towa gauge makes it a little tight too so I always go to the lower number. I also have a hard time with the aluminum bobbins using the guage ...it is jerky.

Heidi

[chickenscratch]

Gosh, you guys can run your machines with the paper torn off the bobbin?

I tried it once, somebody suggested it, and I ended up with slews of tangled thread inside the bobbin case within a few seconds. What a mess.

Must be because my machine is different from yours somehow.

I don\'t know what bobbins I have, probably steel since the machine is so old, but they work great. I also use paper prewounds-with the paper on. The tension is usually about the same for both of those.

[TracyeQ]

How funny the different preferences.

I had only steel w/my old machine. Started using the aluminum that came w/my Freedom SR and liked them. Tried one of the steel ones I had left over and didn\'t like it so ordered more aluminum, and am planning to give the steel ones away.

I\'ve had great tension, it\'s just been a learning experience to get it loose enough. With my old machine I had to take 2 full wraps around the rotary tensioner so this is really different.

I ran Glitter on my last quilt and had to loosen the bobbin a LOT. I normally run it at a drop test of - it falls quickly and easily to the floor, and I had to go looser than that! I was wishing I had a Towa just to see what that setting was. LOL. I have left it there and am running Rainbows on the quilt I\'m on now and it\'s stitching beautifully.

I think I\'ll probably be sticking w/the aluminum since I\'ve got things behaving w/them.

This has been a very educational topic. Thanks for starting it.

[annlittle1]

Oh, Heidi, like I\'m said, I\'m just a bit quirky about some things. I like to "see" a number so I use the guage. Probably 95% of the time it is just fine. I do the drop test as I\'m walking over to my machine. If the drop test disagrees with the guage then I follow the drop test. It doesn\'t really take any extra time since I do it while I\'m doing something else at the same time. I know its silly, but its become a habit.